Are The Reform Party Actually a Threat

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  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    Farage is the favourite to win and there is precedent for not standing candidates in vanity elections.

    Okay, so they figure he's gonna win anyway. Thanks.
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    edited July 7
    FWIW, in the Canadian case I know best where an MP resigned and then re-stood in a by-election(Sheila Copps 1996, because her government had failed to keep a major promise), all the other major parties ran candidates against her.
  • They presumably figure their chances are better if and when Farage is suspended from parliament and there is a recall petition for a second by-election.
    Finding a unifying candidate is difficult across parties. Obviously Count Binface doesn’t have such issues. Though he might have problems with the dress code not allowing hats or armour https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-33700928
  • Alan Cresswell Alan Cresswell Admin, 8th Day Host
    I'm seeing suggestions of a non-partisan independent standing as an anti-corruption candidate, on the sole platform of whether the people of Clacton consider Farage to be an honest man or a lazy grifter. Someone following the footsteps of Martin Bell. Just who that would be is another question - I expect if Carol Vorderman wants to stand on that basis she'd get a lot of support, but she has to make that decision. A serious candidate rather than a choice between the protest votes.
  • Yes.
  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    stetson wrote: »
    Farage is the favourite to win and there is precedent for not standing candidates in vanity elections.

    Okay, so they figure he's gonna win anyway. Thanks.

    I would say it's more playing the odds. If he wins against zero opposition he can't claim any particular vindication from the result. If other parties go all out and he still wins it looks bad, and if one of them wins he gets to blow the "establishment's got it in for me" trumpet. The chosen strategy is the most reliable way of ensuring Farage gets nothing from this stunt.
  • DoublethinkDoublethink Admin, 8th Day Host
    It would need to be a fairly right wing candidate but someone who is respected. Martin Bell was somewhat unique in that respect.
  • DoublethinkDoublethink Admin, 8th Day Host
    Possibly a military veteran would work.
  • If Vorderman stood she'd only attract the kind of vile comments the Reform candidate in Makerfield refused to apologise for.

    It'd be great if she did and if she won but it's a big ask for her to put up with more crap.

    I agree with @Arethosemyfeet, the other parties are best keeping out of this.

    I also agree with Badenoch's assessment. He wouldn't be doing this unless he knew he was in the wrong.

    Why give him even more of a platform than he already has?

    If the investigations into his finances lead to his suspension from Parliament as @Heavenlyannie observes, then he's toast.
  • DoublethinkDoublethink Admin, 8th Day Host
    That said, I think it would be hilarious if he lost to Count Binface or the Monster Raving Loony party - when the Hartlepool monkey ran he won and then was so good as mayor he was re-elected next time without the monkey suit.
  • HeavenlyannieHeavenlyannie Shipmate
    edited July 7
    I’d vote for Binface, he seems like a nice bloke; he has previously given his excess fundraising to Shelter.
  • KarlLBKarlLB Shipmate
    Farage is the favourite to win and there is precedent for not standing candidates in vanity elections.

    Fuck that. This is an opportunity to get that toad out of Parliament and should be grasped with both hands.
  • He might be gone ere long if the investigations find against him.

    Poop! Poop!
  • CathscatsCathscats Shipmate
    By other parties not fielding candidates Farage is denied the hoopla of campaigning, the by-election is a non event, and the oxygen of publicity on which Farage thrives is withdrawn. Once he returns to the house of commons the investigations into his financial dealings will proceed.
  • sionisaissionisais Shipmate
    Please, can all the remotely serious parties and potential candidates leave well alone. I’m sure Reform will pay some patsy to stand, to make sure there is an election, but Oh, if the electoral commission was to find out about that!


  • Robertus LRobertus L Shipmate
    I’d vote for Binface, he seems like a nice bloke; he has previously given his excess fundraising to Shelter.

    Don't forget H'Angus the Monkey* who stood as a joke candidate in the election for mayor of Hartlepool in 2002, and unexpectedly won, and was reelected twice. There's hope for Count Binface.

    *H'Angus the Monkey was the mascot of the local football team, The name is reference to an incident during the Napoleonic Wars when a shipwrecked monkey was washed up on the local shore and was hung by the locals who thought it was a French spy.
  • DoublethinkDoublethink Admin, 8th Day Host
    I could have sworn I said that six posts ago.
  • Alan29Alan29 Shipmate
    With the main parties not taking part, it looks like Farage will get re-elected at which point the parliamentary investigation will start again.
    So what is the point of this farce?
  • Alan Cresswell Alan Cresswell Admin, 8th Day Host
    Cathscats wrote: »
    By other parties not fielding candidates Farage is denied the hoopla of campaigning, the by-election is a non event, and the oxygen of publicity on which Farage thrives is withdrawn. Once he returns to the house of commons the investigations into his financial dealings will proceed.
    I've seen comments from a well respected political correspondent that the Parliamentary rules over disclosure of donations and interests apply to the 12 months prior to being elected - if Farage is re-elected then the period over which the investigations can cover will then be the 12 months prior to his re-election (the current investigation can continue, but there would be no option for a Parliamentary investigation into anything else in the 12 months prior to the 2024 general election). If there are other undeclared donations in that 2023-24 period then this move could be an effective way to prevent Parliament investigating them.
  • SarasaSarasa All Saints Host
    My (Reform) MP claims the election is to prove that the establishment is seeking to change the rules of politics so people like Farage can't win fairly, when their donations from British people are blocked. The by-election is so that the people of Clacton can judge Farage's record and integrity. Pretty desperate stuff from my point of view, though I'm finding Facebook comments from people suggesting our MP tests his integrity with a by-election quite funny. He knows he'd lose if he did that.
  • KarlLBKarlLB Shipmate
    God could once and for all demonstrate his existence to my satisfaction by Count Binface winning.
  • Has His Excellency the Count yet confirmed that he will stand?

    I hope he does, and that he does win (unlikely, I know, but...).

    On a more serious note, I see that the Green Party hasn't yet decided whether or not to contest the election - the local party is responsible for this AIUI - but a Green win would be an even better result.
  • chrisstileschrisstiles Hell Host
    edited July 7
    stetson wrote: »
    Farage is the favourite to win and there is precedent for not standing candidates in vanity elections.

    Okay, so they figure he's gonna win anyway. Thanks.

    I would say it's more playing the odds. If he wins against zero opposition he can't claim any particular vindication from the result. If other parties go all out and he still wins it looks bad, and if one of them wins he gets to blow the "establishment's got it in for me" trumpet. The chosen strategy is the most reliable way of ensuring Farage gets nothing from this stunt.

    .. and it gets shown up as the tactic to get out of his current woes that it is.

    (The Greens will not be standing either).
  • Alan Cresswell Alan Cresswell Admin, 8th Day Host
    The Monster Raving Loony Party are reportedly considering standing, and thus splitting the sane vote.
  • The Guardian reports that, earlier today, Count Binface said:

    Labour, Tories, Lib Dems and Greens: I demand you stand down in Clacton.

    I will be a unity candidate and pledge to build at least one affordable house.

    Nigel Farage says he wants The People versus the Establishment.

    So be it. Leave him to me.


  • chrisstileschrisstiles Hell Host
    Presumably as the current investigation ends the clock for declarations is also reset, so he no longer has to answer questions on other donations he might have received before 2024.
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    Cathscats wrote: »
    By other parties not fielding candidates Farage is denied the hoopla of campaigning, the by-election is a non event, and the oxygen of publicity on which Farage thrives is withdrawn. Once he returns to the house of commons the investigations into his financial dealings will proceed.

    I suspect Farage will just try to pick fights with protestors and journalists, both in Clacton itself and, via social media, the great beyond.

    And I honestly don't know enough about British political culture to know how much of a drag it will be on his image that he wins by de facto acclamation. How many among his pool of potential voters are gonna care about how many candidates he faced in his last by-election? I personally lean towards "not many", but I'm open to correction.
  • God hasn't 'proven' his existence to me either @KarlLB but then I don't go through life expecting him to do so. Our mileage may vary.

    That aside, I think @Alan Cresswell is on the money. Farage is out to 'reset the clock' to avoid further investigations into his finances.

    Even more reason for people to reject him and his Party if there aren't enough already.

    Trouble is, most Reform supporters would give him a free pass as it's all clearly an 'establishment' plot to undermine their guy.
  • Alan Cresswell Alan Cresswell Admin, 8th Day Host
    Trouble is, most Reform supporters would give him a free pass as it's all clearly an 'establishment' plot to undermine their guy.
    Though, the sense of entitlement Farage seems to have, that the rules everyone else has to live with in filling out register of interests don't apply to him, is so very very Establishment it hurts.
  • BoogieBoogie Heaven Host
    So, it looks like Farage against Count Binface. I hope nobody else stands and it's a straight contest between the two.

    Then maybe the great public of Clacton will come to their senses and vote for Count Binface.

    I'd open the champagne!
  • HugalHugal Shipmate
    Boogie wrote: »
    So, it looks like Farage against Count Binface. I hope nobody else stands and it's a straight contest between the two.

    Then maybe the great public of Clacton will come to their senses and vote for Count Binface.

    I'd open the champagne![/quotei suspect this is not Farage wants. This is humiliating for him. Other parties are not playing his game. I feel sorry for the people of Clacton. Do they not want a proper MP?
  • HugalHugal Shipmate
    So other parties are not playing Farage’s game. This humiliating for him. No real opposition to prove himself against. He can spin it as they felt they had no chance of winning I guess. Still he must be fuming.
  • He'll spin it all ways round.

    That they know he'll beat them so they aren't standing.

    That it's an 'establishment' trick.

    And much else.

    @Alan Cresswell - in Reform terms the liberal left is also part of the 'establishment'.

    Anyone who isn't Reform is part of the 'establishment.'

    If anyone disagrees with them they are 'part of the establishment.'

    It's a convenient populist catch-all and shorthand for the media, academia, the Westminster system as it stands, local and regional government, any lobby or group Reform disapproves of.

    On a local, regional and national level all Reform can offer is the sowing of distrust in 'established' processes, real or imagined. 'They are all out to get us, the press, the other political parties, woke liberals, faded Tories, the hard left, the ...'

    And so it goes on.
  • sionisaissionisais Shipmate
    A part of me, ie, the most pure and beautiful anarcho-pacifist bit, really wants to stand against Farage on the “Love’n’Peace” platform. The extent to my Wokeness would cause apoplexy in some of his supporters and maybe in Farage himself.
    If only I could get off my arse and have the bottle to do it.
  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host

    Anyone who isn't Reform is part of the 'establishment.'

    If anyone disagrees with them they are 'part of the establishment.'

    It's a convenient populist catch-all and shorthand for the media, academia, the Westminster system as it stands, local and regional government, any lobby or group Reform disapproves of.

    What I don't understand is how anyone falls for it. A privately educated former stockbroker who hasn't had a job in decades that didn't involve being a professional politician and he's supposed to be somehow "anti-establishment"?
  • TurquoiseTasticTurquoiseTastic Kerygmania Host
    edited July 8
    Robertus L wrote: »
    I’d vote for Binface, he seems like a nice bloke; he has previously given his excess fundraising to Shelter.

    Don't forget H'Angus the Monkey* who stood as a joke candidate in the election for mayor of Hartlepool in 2002, and unexpectedly won, and was reelected twice. There's hope for Count Binface.

    *H'Angus the Monkey was the mascot of the local football team, The name is reference to an incident during the Napoleonic Wars when a shipwrecked monkey was washed up on the local shore and was hung by the locals who thought it was a French spy.

    TBH I was disappointed with H'Angus. People voted for him on the basis of his being a joke candidate making a mockery of the system... but then he took the job seriously and was a pretty good mayor ... he let his voters down....
  • BoogieBoogie Heaven Host
    Please can we have another Question Time special? I would very much enjoy seeing Farage and the Count going head to head on national TV!
  • chrisstileschrisstiles Hell Host
    I have to say that I find Count Binface tedious - a bit like Ian Hislop on Have I Got News for You or Marina Hyde's 'witty' columns.
  • LouiseLouise Epiphanies Host
    edited July 8
    I'll take tedious over fascist though!
  • chrisstileschrisstiles Hell Host
    Yeah, but I'm minded of Peter Cook's comments about "those wonderful Berlin cabarets" and his warning that "Britain is in danger of sinking giggling into the sea"
  • With the serious parties all boycotting The Nigel Farage Show, it's to be hoped that the Noos will not be dominated by this wretched man, who really should do us all a favour, and emigrate to the US.

    Not that I wish any more misery on the US, as they have enough of their own to cope with, but Farage is such a little man that he probably wouldn't do much harm there
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    edited July 8
    I have to say that I find Count Binface tedious - a bit like Ian Hislop on Have I Got News for You or Marina Hyde's 'witty' columns.

    Funny you mention Marina Hyde. Yesterday, after a lifetime of avoiding Hunter S. Thompson(but of course knowing who he was and his reputation), I started reading a collection of his later writing, and it immediately put me in mind of the stuff I've seen by Marina Hyde in The Guardian, in terms of how they both just take a situation in the news and then spend the whole column coming up with one clever metaphor etc after another to apply to it, minus any analysis or prediction.

    I pretty much dropped Hyde after a few of her columns, and I'm thinking I might not last that long with Thompson, either.
  • Alan Cresswell Alan Cresswell Admin, 8th Day Host
    Yeah, but I'm minded of Peter Cook's comments about "those wonderful Berlin cabarets" and his warning that "Britain is in danger of sinking giggling into the sea"
    Better to sink giggling into the sea than sink under the heavy tread of jackboots.
  • chrisstileschrisstiles Hell Host
    Yeah, but I'm minded of Peter Cook's comments about "those wonderful Berlin cabarets" and his warning that "Britain is in danger of sinking giggling into the sea"
    Better to sink giggling into the sea than sink under the heavy tread of jackboots.

    The former facilitates the latter by avoiding dealing with real issues.
  • TurquoiseTasticTurquoiseTastic Kerygmania Host
    However if Binface were to beat Farage he would have performed a genuinely useful political service.
  • chrisstileschrisstiles Hell Host
    Well, the problem with only a joke opposition character running is that you underline the notion that politicians don't care for them in the mind of the electorate.

    And in this case it isn't even a purely organic candidate.
  • TurquoiseTasticTurquoiseTastic Kerygmania Host
    Well, the problem with only a joke opposition character running is that you underline the notion that politicians don't care for them in the mind of the electorate.

    And in this case it isn't even a purely organic candidate.

    I agree that this is the danger. But that comes from the boycott by the main parties, not from the fact that Binface is running. The message is: "we think this is a vanity stunt by Farage, we will ignore it". Of course since Clacton is a prime Reform area this may re-inforce the sense of "these snooty Westminster types think we're beneath contempt, let's re-elect Nigel with a massive majority..."
  • DoublethinkDoublethink Admin, 8th Day Host
    Well judged post by Reeves I think:
    I will accept Nigel Farage’s request to be appointed Steward and Bailiff of the Manor of Northstead.

    It is a farce and a desperate distraction, and the people of Clacton deserve better.

    But if he wants to spend the summer arguing with a bin, I won't stop him.
  • Well judged post by Reeves I think:
    I will accept Nigel Farage’s request to be appointed Steward and Bailiff of the Manor of Northstead.

    It is a farce and a desperate distraction, and the people of Clacton deserve better.

    But if he wants to spend the summer arguing with a bin, I won't stop him.

    :lol:

    ...and Andy Burnham remarks that it's good to know when bin day is...

    Meanwhile, Count Binface has already raised about £15k for his election campaign. I'm tempted to bung him a couple of ££, just for the hell of it.

    I wonder how long it'll take for Farage to realise what a complete fool he's making of himself?
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