I'd heard about it before but not been to one. It was very good, a lot of darkness/light stuff. I wasn't feeling particularly blue (went along to support the organisers) but found it very moving and thought-provoking.
We’ve been doing them for maybe 10 years, and they seem fairly common around here. It’s the sort of service that isn’t for everyone, but for some people—perhaps, for example, people grieving the recent death of a loved one and anticipating Christmas without that loved one—can be very meaningful.
I haven't heard of any being held in Our Town (though I daresay there have been one or two), but I did suggest Our Place might do something along these lines.
O! you'd have thought I was advocating the worship of Mithras, the way some people carried on! Christmas is all about Joy and Cheerfulness, no matter what, and singing *Happy Birthday* to Baby Jesus!
My suggestion did involve a bit of self-interest, as I'm one of those poor benighted souls for whom Christmas is not a particularly happy time, personally, although I'm OK with celebrating the Incarnation per se.
It's the enforced jollity - even in church - that grates so painfully, and there often seems no escape, apart from simply absenting oneself.
I haven't heard of any being held in Our Town (though I daresay there have been one or two), but I did suggest Our Place might do something along these lines.
O! you'd have thought I was advocating the worship of Mithras, the way some people carried on! Christmas is all about Joy and Cheerfulness, no matter what, and singing *Happy Birthday* to Baby Jesus!
Being *blue* at this time of year Is Outrage...
That's what makes me blue at Christmas: forced participation (with a smile...it's Christmas...come on, buddy!) in the same family/friends activities as every year. I'm not naturally festive, and certainly not on cue. I'm glad when "this holiday season" is over and we stop hearing that phrase.
I haven't heard of any being held in Our Town (though I daresay there have been one or two), but I did suggest Our Place might do something along these lines.
O! you'd have thought I was advocating the worship of Mithras, the way some people carried on! Christmas is all about Joy and Cheerfulness, no matter what, and singing *Happy Birthday* to Baby Jesus!
Being *blue* at this time of year Is Outrage...
That's what makes me blue at Christmas: forced participation (with a smile...it's Christmas...come on, buddy!) in the same family/friends activities as every year. I'm not naturally festive, and certainly not on cue. I'm glad when "this holiday season" is over and we stop hearing that phrase.
Yes, it's not a *holiday season* for everyone, in any case. I could tell you some horror stories about working for the Ambulance Service on Christmas Day...although we did once manage to get to the hospital canteen in time for the last of the FREE Christmas dinner.
All that was left of the turkey were Crispy Brown Bits, but, as enny fule kno, Crispy Brown Bits are a recognised food group.
Thank you Alan. A minor question - what language was the Mass in please?
German of which I know very little. However I know the texts like the back of my hand. The homily was summarised by my wife who has excellent German.
One of the great advantages of a Mass in Latin is that it's a common language
For speakers of German, GOTTESLOB is the prayer-book, missal and hymnal combined and I possess a copy of that book which I bought on my travels to Germany some years ago. This book is amply supplied in Catholic churches in that country. The title translates, "God's Praise".
I suppose that these days English has taken the place of Latin in the Western world. Things may be different where others are, but around here Cantonese is far more common than Shanghaiese (is there such a word?)
I suppose, you refer to the VERNACULAR, meaning the local language used rather than Latin.
Thank you Alan. A minor question - what language was the Mass in please?
German of which I know very little. However I know the texts like the back of my hand. The homily was summarised by my wife who has excellent German.
One of the great advantages of a Mass in Latin is that it's a common language
For speakers of German, GOTTESLOB is the prayer-book, missal and hymnal combined and I possess a copy of that book which I bought on my travels to Germany some years ago. This book is amply supplied in Catholic churches in that country. The title translates, "God's Praise".
I suppose that these days English has taken the place of Latin in the Western world. Things may be different where others are, but around here Cantonese is far more common than Shanghaiese (is there such a word?)
I suppose, you refer to the VERNACULAR, meaning the local language used rather than Latin.
Thank you Alan. A minor question - what language was the Mass in please?
German of which I know very little. However I know the texts like the back of my hand. The homily was summarised by my wife who has excellent German.
One of the great advantages of a Mass in Latin is that it's a common language
For speakers of German, GOTTESLOB is the prayer-book, missal and hymnal combined and I possess a copy of that book which I bought on my travels to Germany some years ago. This book is amply supplied in Catholic churches in that country. The title translates, "God's Praise".
I suppose that these days English has taken the place of Latin in the Western world. Things may be different where others are, but around here Cantonese is far more common than Shanghaiese (is there such a word?)
I suppose, you refer to the VERNACULAR, meaning the local language used rather than Latin.
No, I meant what I said.
OK, my mention of vernacular adds to the discussion,
Back to what is being (or has been) sung in church at this festive period, I was horrified to read FatherInCharge's latest newsletter, in which he says that we MUST sing *Good King Wenceslaus* at the 10am Mass on Monday. He wants the Men to sing the King's words, and the Ladies and Children to sing those of the Page, but it is rather doubtful if there will be many people in church at all...
O, and we MUST sing *Happy Birthday to you* to Jesus after Mass on Christmas morning, as Jesus' birthday cake is shared around...
I'm OK with Good King Wenceslas (as long as there are enough of each voice pitch to make it worth while) - it's quite fun (and there's a good descant for those of us what like that sort of thing).
But singing Happy Birthday to Jesus??? As you say,
9 lessons and carols, with an Actual Organist!
We had:
Once in royal
In the bleak midwinter
Of the Father's love begotten
Love came down at Christmas
Unto us a boy is born
The angel Gabriel from heaven came
See in yonder manger low
Hark the herald angels sing
The first nowell
Before the world began
O come, all ye faithful
It came upon the midnight clear (Carol)
Lo, how a Rose e'er blooming (Es ist ein Ros')
Angels, from the realms of glory (Regent Square)
On Christmas night all Christians sing (The Sussex Carol)
O come, all ye faithful (Adeste fideles)
Hark! the herald angels sing (Mendelssohn)
O little town of Bethlehem (Forest Green)
Silent night, holy night (Stille Nacht)
Angels we have heard on high (Gloria)
Choral:
Haydn: Missa brevis Sancti Joannis de Deo ("Kleine Orgelmesse")
Chad McCoy: Childing of a maiden bright (2010)
Poulenc: O magnum mysterium (1952)
O Come, All Ye Faithful Come, Come Emmanuel What Child Is This? There’s a Star in the East (Rise Up, Shepherd, and Follow) Silent Night (with guitar, banjo, viola, cello, and no organ or piano) Joy to the World
Midnight Communion at Our Place:
On Christmas night all Christians sing SUSSEX CAROL
God rest ye merry, gentlemen GOD REST YOU MERRY
O little town of Bethlehem FOREST GREEN
O come all ye faithful ADESTE FIDELES (At last, we get to sing the final verse!)
And back again for the Christmas morning service:
O come all ye faithful ADESTE FIDELES
Once in royal David's city IRBY
Joy to the world ANTIOCH
Hark the herald angels sing MENDELSSOHN
Midnight Mass at Sheffield RC cathedral. Jammed solid with a high proportion of people from India. All the usual carols, but no O come all ye faithful and While shepherd's watched wasn't sung to the hoped for On Ilkley Moor - shame.
Introit - Hark the herald angels sing
Offertory - While shepherds watched (a long hymn was necessary here, to cover the preparation of the Altar and the preparation of the Holy Cake)
Communion - Away in a manger
Visit to the Crib - Happy Birthday to you
Final hymn - The first Nowell
Not sure why, but the Bethlehem Carol Sheets were used, as opposed to our default hymnbook. However, all the tunes were what one might call the *usual suspects*.
For various reasons, possibly connected with the economic, health, and social difficulties of the time, we have had very few families with children at any of our Christmas services.
We had, O Come All Ye Faithful at the beginning and Hark, the Herald Angels - and one in the middle I can’t remember, was fairly unfamiliar, 378 in some additions of hymns ancient and modern.
We began with “The holly and the Ivy are dancing in a ring” (a rather tritecway to begin Christmas worship)
Then it was O come all ye faithful. (Hats off to Mr Cats at the organ who hadn’t checked the number of verses and was playing the usual four. But Methodists don’t really think a hymn is finished till it has 6 verses. So I heard him play for choirs of angels when we were singing about shepherds, and Piglet’s favourite chord came in the verse about Magi. I was waiting for the awful silence of an organist finishing too soon when he realised and played the last two verses again with even more panache so we had The Chord twice!)
Then, being Methodists we had “There’s a light upon the mountains” which seems to come out on all occasions.
Then a sermon about feet. We know far too much about his feet now…
Good Christian friends, rejoice (In dulci jubilo)
Once in royal David's city (Irby)
What child is this, who. laid to rest (Greensleeves)
Joy to the world! the Lord is come (Antioch)
Choral:
Baldassare Galuppi: Missa in C
Peter Warlock: Bethlehem Down
Things were kept simple at our place this morning, with a lessons and carols format. The carols/hymns were:
Go Tell It on the Mountain Hark! The Herald Angels Sing O Little Town of Bethlehem/ST. LOUIS Away in a Manger/CRADLE SONG Hark! The Herald Angels Sing (Jesus, the Light of the World)* On this Day Earth Shall Ring/PERSONENT HODIE Angels We Have Heard on High/GLORIA
“Angels from the realms of glory”.
“Come and sing the Christmas story” (Ar Hyd Y Nos).
“It came upon a midnight clear”.
“In a byre near Bethlehem” (Wild Mountain Thyme).
“All poor men and humble” (Olwen).
“O little town of Bethlehem”.
Christmas Day Family Service.
“Joy to the world”.
“Come and join the celebration”.
“The Bells Ring Out” (Sweet Chiming Bells).
“Who is he in yonder stall”.
“O come, all ye faithful”.
Oh it was the preacher’s feet. Apparently they are very ugly, which was extirpated on at length. But if they bring good news thy are beautiful….
A very far-fetched theme. How long did he spend on it?
This was the whole message.
As an ex-minister I find church difficult. But this sort of thing does not help! Glad that most Sundays I am working in a non-church job. Glad too that none of this affects my faith.
Not church, but in a Yorkshire pub where there is a tradition of local carols. Among others we sang While Shepherds Watched five times, each to a different tune, none of them the dull churchy one.
No, neither of them, though we were at Grenoside where the second clip was recorded.
Mrs Alan and I surmised that a carol about shepherds would be popular in a sheep farming area, and maybe village chapels came up with their own tunes.
No, neither of them, though we were at Grenoside where the second clip was recorded.
Mrs Alan and I surmised that a carol about shepherds would be popular in a sheep farming area, and maybe village chapels came up with their own tunes.
Indeed, that may well be so.
Meanwhile, did anyone sing Good King Wenceslaus at church yesterday? They probably did at Our Place...
However, a browse around Swedish churches on YouTube reveals that a fair few celebrated St Stephen's Day (with red vestments etc.) as a sort of general commemoration of martyrs. The hymns were unfamiliar to this Englishman, but it did look as though what in this country would be very much a non-day in many churches had small, but perfectly formed, congregations in Sweden.
I daresay FatherInCharge will get people to sing Unto Us A Boy Is Born tomorrow (Holy Innocents), as it includes the bit about Herod, in his fury, killing all the little boys in Bethlehem.
St Stephen's day ( or the 'second Christmas day' as it is sometimes called) will generally have quite large congregations in Central Europe.
Well, the Swedish churches (Lutheran) I've visited online haven't had large congregations (I get the impression that most Swedish churches are not particularly well-attended anyway), but they have at least had a full sung Hogmassa, with sermon...
Here is a posher, but still lusty, rendition of "Old Foster". I particularly like the ripieno section after each verse, although it does perhaps get a bit tedious by the sixth time! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6djjh5eGGeQ
Joy to the world - Antioch Unto us a boy is born - Puer nobis nascitur O come, all ye faithful - Adeste fideles Child in the manger - Bunessan Hark! the herald angels sing - Mendelssohn
Christmas Eve included:
Once in royal David's city - Irby (with solo piglet) O come, all ye faithful - Adeste fideles (but no last verse, so no Chord! ) Silent Night - Stille Nacht O little town of Bethlehem - Forest Green
and one or two others that I've forgotten, as they were on a sheet that was to be left in the church.
Joy to the world - Antioch Unto us a boy is born - Puer nobis nascitur O come, all ye faithful - Adeste fideles Child in the manger - Bunessan Hark! the herald angels sing - Mendelssohn
Christmas Eve included:
Once in royal David's city - Irby (with solo piglet) O come, all ye faithful - Adeste fideles (but no last verse, so no Chord! ) Silent Night - Stille Nacht O little town of Bethlehem - Forest Green
and one or two others that I've forgotten, as they were on a sheet that was to be left in the church.
A goodly selection, though I personally wouldn't have included Unto us a boy is born - that's for Holy Innocents (today)!
Child in the manger to Bunessan is a gem.
BTW, I think you said the Christmas Eve congregation was somewhat sparse - were there more in church on Christmas Day morning?
Comments
O! you'd have thought I was advocating the worship of Mithras, the way some people carried on! Christmas is all about Joy and Cheerfulness, no matter what, and singing *Happy Birthday* to Baby Jesus!
Being *blue* at this time of year Is Outrage...
“ I will weep when you are weeping,
when you laugh, I’ll laugh with you.
I will share your joy and sorrow
Till we’ve seen this journey through”
It's the enforced jollity - even in church - that grates so painfully, and there often seems no escape, apart from simply absenting oneself.
That's what makes me blue at Christmas: forced participation (with a smile...it's Christmas...come on, buddy!) in the same family/friends activities as every year. I'm not naturally festive, and certainly not on cue. I'm glad when "this holiday season" is over and we stop hearing that phrase.
Yes, it's not a *holiday season* for everyone, in any case. I could tell you some horror stories about working for the Ambulance Service on Christmas Day...although we did once manage to get to the hospital canteen in time for the last of the FREE Christmas dinner.
All that was left of the turkey were Crispy Brown Bits, but, as enny fule kno, Crispy Brown Bits are a recognised food group.
— Nick Tamen, who is not a fan of turkey
Actually, I agree...
I suppose, you refer to the VERNACULAR, meaning the local language used rather than Latin.
No, I meant what I said.
OK, my mention of vernacular adds to the discussion,
O, and we MUST sing *Happy Birthday to you* to Jesus after Mass on Christmas morning, as Jesus' birthday cake is shared around...
🤮
But singing Happy Birthday to Jesus??? As you say,
We had:
Once in royal
In the bleak midwinter
Of the Father's love begotten
Love came down at Christmas
Unto us a boy is born
The angel Gabriel from heaven came
See in yonder manger low
Hark the herald angels sing
The first nowell
Before the world began
O come, all ye faithful
It came upon the midnight clear (Carol)
Lo, how a Rose e'er blooming (Es ist ein Ros')
Angels, from the realms of glory (Regent Square)
On Christmas night all Christians sing (The Sussex Carol)
O come, all ye faithful (Adeste fideles)
Hark! the herald angels sing (Mendelssohn)
O little town of Bethlehem (Forest Green)
Silent night, holy night (Stille Nacht)
Angels we have heard on high (Gloria)
Choral:
Haydn: Missa brevis Sancti Joannis de Deo ("Kleine Orgelmesse")
Chad McCoy: Childing of a maiden bright (2010)
Poulenc: O magnum mysterium (1952)
O Come, All Ye Faithful
Come, Come Emmanuel
What Child Is This?
There’s a Star in the East (Rise Up, Shepherd, and Follow)
Silent Night (with guitar, banjo, viola, cello, and no organ or piano)
Joy to the World
On Christmas night all Christians sing SUSSEX CAROL
God rest ye merry, gentlemen GOD REST YOU MERRY
O little town of Bethlehem FOREST GREEN
O come all ye faithful ADESTE FIDELES (At last, we get to sing the final verse!)
And back again for the Christmas morning service:
O come all ye faithful ADESTE FIDELES
Once in royal David's city IRBY
Joy to the world ANTIOCH
Hark the herald angels sing MENDELSSOHN
Introit - Hark the herald angels sing
Offertory - While shepherds watched (a long hymn was necessary here, to cover the preparation of the Altar and the preparation of the Holy Cake)
Communion - Away in a manger
Visit to the Crib - Happy Birthday to you
Final hymn - The first Nowell
Not sure why, but the Bethlehem Carol Sheets were used, as opposed to our default hymnbook. However, all the tunes were what one might call the *usual suspects*.
For various reasons, possibly connected with the economic, health, and social difficulties of the time, we have had very few families with children at any of our Christmas services.
O come all ye faithful
O little town of Bethlehem (to Forest Green
And two more, sung by the choir (in English) as Psalm, and Offertory motet:
God rest ye merry gentlemen (to the traditional tune, as arranged by Willcocks)
Hark the heard angels sing (to Mendelsohn's tune)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G28-iKN2hNo
Then it was O come all ye faithful. (Hats off to Mr Cats at the organ who hadn’t checked the number of verses and was playing the usual four. But Methodists don’t really think a hymn is finished till it has 6 verses. So I heard him play for choirs of angels when we were singing about shepherds, and Piglet’s favourite chord came in the verse about Magi. I was waiting for the awful silence of an organist finishing too soon when he realised and played the last two verses again with even more panache so we had The Chord twice!)
Then, being Methodists we had “There’s a light upon the mountains” which seems to come out on all occasions.
Then a sermon about feet. We know far too much about his feet now…
“Love came down at Christmas”
“Joy to the world.”
Enquiring minds need to know...
Good Christian friends, rejoice (In dulci jubilo)
Once in royal David's city (Irby)
What child is this, who. laid to rest (Greensleeves)
Joy to the world! the Lord is come (Antioch)
Choral:
Baldassare Galuppi: Missa in C
Peter Warlock: Bethlehem Down
Hopefully your minister doesn't use a screen / projector to illustrate his sermons! 👣
Go Tell It on the Mountain
Hark! The Herald Angels Sing
O Little Town of Bethlehem/ST. LOUIS
Away in a Manger/CRADLE SONG
Hark! The Herald Angels Sing (Jesus, the Light of the World)*
On this Day Earth Shall Ring/PERSONENT HODIE
Angels We Have Heard on High/GLORIA
*No, this wasn’t an accidental repeat of an earlier hymn. This second round was the riff on Charles Wesley’s text published by George Ekderkin in the late 1800s.
A very far-fetched theme. How long did he spend on it?
I hope the ugliness of his feet wasn't his sole point.
Ugliness of feet may be a part of the Moore College teaching on how and what to preach.
I saw what you did there.
“Angels from the realms of glory”.
“Come and sing the Christmas story” (Ar Hyd Y Nos).
“It came upon a midnight clear”.
“In a byre near Bethlehem” (Wild Mountain Thyme).
“All poor men and humble” (Olwen).
“O little town of Bethlehem”.
Christmas Day Family Service.
“Joy to the world”.
“Come and join the celebration”.
“The Bells Ring Out” (Sweet Chiming Bells).
“Who is he in yonder stall”.
“O come, all ye faithful”.
He does, but thankfully not this time.
This was the whole message.
As an ex-minister I find church difficult. But this sort of thing does not help! Glad that most Sundays I am working in a non-church job. Glad too that none of this affects my faith.
I guessed somebody would.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04FTLQaFBJI
Or possibly *St Helena*:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKKsEPEJOOY
Mrs Alan and I surmised that a carol about shepherds would be popular in a sheep farming area, and maybe village chapels came up with their own tunes.
Indeed, that may well be so.
Meanwhile, did anyone sing Good King Wenceslaus at church yesterday? They probably did at Our Place...
However, a browse around Swedish churches on YouTube reveals that a fair few celebrated St Stephen's Day (with red vestments etc.) as a sort of general commemoration of martyrs. The hymns were unfamiliar to this Englishman, but it did look as though what in this country would be very much a non-day in many churches had small, but perfectly formed, congregations in Sweden.
I daresay FatherInCharge will get people to sing Unto Us A Boy Is Born tomorrow (Holy Innocents), as it includes the bit about Herod, in his fury, killing all the little boys in Bethlehem.
Well, the Swedish churches (Lutheran) I've visited online haven't had large congregations (I get the impression that most Swedish churches are not particularly well-attended anyway), but they have at least had a full sung Hogmassa, with sermon...
I don't know "St Helena". "As Shepherds WatchedTheir Fleecy Care" is also good: in here: https://afolksongaweek.wordpress.com/tag/magpie-lane/page/2/
Joy to the world - Antioch
Unto us a boy is born - Puer nobis nascitur
O come, all ye faithful - Adeste fideles
Child in the manger - Bunessan
Hark! the herald angels sing - Mendelssohn
Christmas Eve included:
Once in royal David's city - Irby (with solo piglet)
O come, all ye faithful - Adeste fideles (but no last verse, so no Chord!
Silent Night - Stille Nacht
O little town of Bethlehem - Forest Green
and one or two others that I've forgotten, as they were on a sheet that was to be left in the church.
A goodly selection, though I personally wouldn't have included Unto us a boy is born - that's for Holy Innocents (today)!
Child in the manger to Bunessan is a gem.
BTW, I think you said the Christmas Eve congregation was somewhat sparse - were there more in church on Christmas Day morning?
I don't know if it was because the weather was less horrid, or just that a lot of people "do" church on Christmas Day.
Having seen the hymn list for New Year's Day, I think I'll go again - we're getting UUABIB again, and it's one of my favourites.