Heaven: 2021 Proof Americans and Brits speak a different language

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  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    mousethief wrote: »
    Gee D wrote: »
    mousethief wrote: »
    I'm starting to think there are as many carbonaras as there are carbonara chefs.

    I'd started and finished with that.

    Where?

    Not on the thread, but in my thinking about all the recipes.
  • Gee D wrote: »
    mousethief wrote: »
    Gee D wrote: »
    mousethief wrote: »
    I'm starting to think there are as many carbonaras as there are carbonara chefs.

    I'd started and finished with that.

    Where?

    Not on the thread, but in my thinking about all the recipes.

    Sorry, I was chewing loud and I missed it.
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate, Glory
    mousethief wrote: »
    I'm starting to think there are as many carbonaras as there are carbonara chefs.

    Like curry powders. I've heard that families in India have their own recipes. I've tried a bunch of store-bought curry powders. Trader Joe's suits me fine.
  • KarlLB wrote: »
    "Carbonara sauce" is just egg and a bit of pasta cooking water.

    I know some people do something with cream under the name but it's Wrong.

    Cream = wrong.
    Carbonara is my favorite pasta dish. But I never order it in a restaurant without first asking if it has cream in it. If the answer is yes, I pass.

    But using pancetta instead of guanciale is common, at least in my experience. As noted, it’s easier to get.

  • orfeo wrote: »
    This language thread devolves into food on a very regular basis.
    In a thread that’s lasted over a 100 pages in the course of a year and a half, you have to stop to eat every now and then.

  • And both food and language are prone to snobbery, but I suppose everything is.
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate, Glory
    Nick Tamen wrote: »
    orfeo wrote: »
    This language thread devolves into food on a very regular basis.
    In a thread that’s lasted over a 100 pages in the course of a year and a half, you have to stop to eat every now and then.

    LOL. :notworthy:
  • jedijudyjedijudy Heaven Host
    As my friend and co-Host Trudy mentioned recently, there's a thread for deliciousness! There are probably several Shipmates who don't read this thread, but who are very interested in At The Table! You don't want to cheat them of your thoughts about food, do you!

    jedijudy
    Heaven Host doing a slight nudge in the right direction...
  • Golden Key wrote: »
    mousethief wrote: »
    I'm starting to think there are as many carbonaras as there are carbonara chefs.

    Like curry powders. I've heard that families in India have their own recipes. I've tried a bunch of store-bought curry powders. Trader Joe's suits me fine.

    I've never used curry powder, because you don't know what's in it. It needs to be different for every kind of curry you make, or sometimes just for the mood you happen to be in while cooking. I mix mine as I go, with some help from recipes I got from an Indian friend years ago. (My American wife is happy with prefabricated powders and makes annoyingly good curries with them, despite my advice).
  • Alan Cresswell Alan Cresswell Admin, 8th Day Host
    If you want to curry favour with the Heavenly Hosts I strongly recommend you heed their posts directing you to the appropriate thread that already exists for discussing recipes and cooking. The alternative could leave an unpleasant taste in your mouth.

    Alan
    Ship of Fools Admin
  • I grovel.
  • Does that make you a groveler or a groveller?
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate, Glory
    We all curry the H/As' favor. ;) And obey.
    (curtsey)
  • Bad girl. You'll get fried!
  • LeafLeaf Shipmate
    Cross-Pond references that I first encountered on the Ship:

    "taking the piss" - I think this means teasing or joking?
    "over-egging" - I don't quite know how to paraphrase. Does it mean something like "inappropriately emphasizing one aspect" of something?
    "different to" - this usage will get severe and repeated correction at school here. Always must be different from, similar to and God help you if you use "different to".

    Cross-Pond conversational difference:

    "You all right?" is not used here as a greeting but a question of genuine concern for the other person, indicating that they are showing signs of distress. I understand that speakers of other languages experience similar confusion with the greeting "How are you?" Uhh, do I not seem well? Do you really want to know? How much or what kind of information is being requested? In fact no information is being requested, it's just a greeting.
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate, Glory
    ...though I sometimes ask clerks, bus drivers, etc. how their day is going. I care about the answer (and them) for the moments we're together. But I don't necessarily mull it over past that. (Sometimes, though.)

    It can be a good way to develop friendly acquaintanceships.
  • Usually when we go to pick up groceries (curbside pickup) we will ask the clerk who brings the grox to our car, "so has it been a slow day today, or pretty busy?" It gives them a chance to respond as little or as much as they want. "Slow" if they're feeling terse, or sometimes you get a little bit of convo about how it started out slow and then we got slammed at 3:00—something like that.
  • LeafLeaf Shipmate
    Golden Key wrote: »
    ...though I sometimes ask clerks, bus drivers, etc. how their day is going.

    "How is your day going?" is a different question from "How are you?"
    The former indicates genuine interest in the answer, and expectation of more content. IME the latter usually functions as a simple greeting, and the expected response is a brief "Good, you?"

  • DafydDafyd Hell Host
    Leaf wrote: »
    "taking the piss" - I think this means teasing or joking?
    UK here - with connotations that the person ought to be more serious. Often sarcastic to indicate a claim too ridiculous to be truthful. Taking the piss out of someone is not quite kind but more honest than just taking the piss.
    "over-egging" - I don't quite know how to paraphrase. Does it mean something like "inappropriately emphasizing one aspect" of something?
    I think it's any form of overemphasis. In particular making something more sentimental than necessary or spelling it out for emotional effect.
  • The full phrase is "over-egging the pudding", if that helps.

    "Different to" sounds pretty fine to my ears, although "from" is generally a tad better. "Different than" however (which seems to be a US import) is still a rake in the face on the lawn of conversation.
  • We had an unspoken agreement in our family that there were certain people you never asked 'How are you', because they would actually tell you. At great length, and in gory detail.
  • FirenzeFirenze Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    The fuller version 'over-egging the pudding' makes it clearer.

    In Belfast, they'd say 'How about you?' - usually shortened to 'bout ye?

    'How'r ye' is more an exclamation of incredulity, milder than 'Away and catch yerself on'.
  • Gill H wrote: »
    We had an unspoken agreement in our family that there were certain people you never asked 'How are you', because they would actually tell you. At great length, and in gory detail.

    Likewise.

    When in doubt, don’t ask.

  • BroJamesBroJames Purgatory Host
    Firenze wrote: »
    The fuller version 'over-egging the pudding' makes it clearer.

    In Belfast, they'd say 'How about you?' - usually shortened to 'bout ye?

    'How'r ye' is more an exclamation of incredulity, milder than 'Away and catch yerself on'.

    And the Doric, of course, is ‘Fit like?’
  • The local versions are "Y'kay?" or "Awri'?" Younger denizens will say "'Up bro?" Which translate into versions of "(Are) you OK?" "(Are you) alright?", and "What's up, bro?". None of which expect much of an answer.

    "How's things?" is more of an opening gambit.
  • Sojourner wrote: »
    Gill H wrote: »
    We had an unspoken agreement in our family that there were certain people you never asked 'How are you', because they would actually tell you. At great length, and in gory detail.

    Likewise.

    When in doubt, don’t ask.

    Those who enjoy ill-health - literally.

  • 'Mustn't grumble' used to be heard from older UK citizens. Less often these days.
  • BroJames wrote: »
    Firenze wrote: »
    The fuller version 'over-egging the pudding' makes it clearer.

    In Belfast, they'd say 'How about you?' - usually shortened to 'bout ye?

    'How'r ye' is more an exclamation of incredulity, milder than 'Away and catch yerself on'.

    And the Doric, of course, is ‘Fit like?’

    And two good answers to that will be, "Nae affa weel", or if things are really bad, "Affa nae weel".
  • TrudyTrudy Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    In Newfoundland the shortest way of asking that question is, "Y'at?" Short for "Whaddya at" [what are you at?] which technically means "What are you doing?" but really means "How are you/What is currently happening in your life/etc."

    The only acceptable answers are "Not much" or "This is it." Answering "Y'at?" with a detailed description of your current work or leisure activities is as socially inappropriate as answering "How are you?" with a description of how painful your gallstones are.
  • "different than" is abrasive to literate teeth everywhere.
  • Although "different than" is linguistically interesting, as it may show a spread from comparatives, e.g., better than. I wonder if it's increasing. There is also "other than", quite rare I think, but showing the influence of than.
  • "Other than" is quite common over here.
  • There is also "other than", quite rare I think, but showing the influence of than.

    "Other than @mousethief, who else finds this a common usage?"
  • There is also "other than", quite rare I think, but showing the influence of than.

    "Other than @mousethief, who else finds this a common usage?"

    I would say it's found in educated standard English. Or, if you like, it's posh.
  • Lamb ChoppedLamb Chopped Shipmate
    edited February 2021
    There is also "other than", quite rare I think, but showing the influence of than.

    "Other than @mousethief, who else finds this a common usage?"

    I do. And it's not standard or posh here in America, it's just... English.

    "Does anybody want more beer? Other than X, I mean."
  • Yes, “other than” is very common and normal in my experience. I’m not sure what the alternative would be.

  • Nick Tamen wrote: »
    Yes, “other than” is very common and normal in my experience. I’m not sure what the alternative would be.

    Apart from. Except. Not counting.
  • Nick Tamen wrote: »
    Yes, “other than” is very common and normal in my experience. I’m not sure what the alternative would be.

    Apart from. Except. Not counting.

    If I say "Except for mousethief, who wants a beer?" then our felonious rodent is going thirsty. "Other than mousethief, who wants a beer?" means that I already know mousethief wants beer. "Apart from" has the same meaning as "Other than".

    I think if I was to start a sentence with "Not counting mousethief," I'd have to continue with "how many people want beer?"
  • Yes, it's pretty standard usage.
  • Appears in a widespread black-humor joke with the punchline "Other than that, how did you like the play, Mrs. Lincoln?"
  • Nick Tamen wrote: »
    Yes, “other than” is very common and normal in my experience. I’m not sure what the alternative would be.

    Apart from. Except. Not counting.
    Oh sure. I meant an alternative using “other,” similar to consideration of “different from/to/than.” Sorry I wasn’t clear.

  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    edited February 2021
    Although "different than" is linguistically interesting, as it may show a spread from comparatives, e.g., better than. I wonder if it's increasing. There is also "other than", quite rare I think, but showing the influence of than.

    "Other than" is common here also. "Different than" is sadly also in common use. Why it is is beyond my understanding as "different to" or even "from" takes no effort.
  • "Different to" makes absolutely no sense to me.
  • mousethief wrote: »
    "Different to" makes absolutely no sense to me.

    I'd assume this use comes from beginning with "similar to", and then substituting "different" for "similar".
  • mousethief wrote: »
    "Different to" makes absolutely no sense to me.

    I'd assume this use comes from beginning with "similar to", and then substituting "different" for "similar".

    I think a lot of these forms happen like that, by analogy.
  • Gee D wrote: »
    Although "different than" is linguistically interesting, as it may show a spread from comparatives, e.g., better than. I wonder if it's increasing. There is also "other than", quite rare I think, but showing the influence of than.

    "Other than" is common here also. "Different than" is sadly also in common use. Why it is is beyond my understanding as "different to" or even "from" takes no effort.

    Because meaning is arbitrary. There is no intrinsic meaning to "different" and "than".
  • The opposite of "intrinsic" is not "arbitrary".
  • MMMMMM Shipmate
    I would have thought ‘other than’ is quite common here (UK) as well.


    MMM
  • This may have been mentioned before, but 'bored of' always sets my teeth on edge. 'Tiredof', yes, but 'bred by'. And also use of 'of' for 'have' in print: 'You should of' - ugh.
  • I'd say: "I'm bored of dealing with your mess!" to someone when yelling at them to clear up.
    or, when referring to the conversation, to being bored of/by the permanent tip surrounding said individual, interchangeably. I think the difference is whether I'm linking the "bored" to a noun or a verb.
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